Chinese tones

[bossel]

You dont need rising tone to ask a question.
"Lai bu lai? (Come or come not?)" or "Ni lai ma? (You come 'question particle')" would do the deal.

[Maciamo]

Thanks for the explanation seasurfer. Bu what about all the other emotions I listed in my first posts ? Is there words or grammatical structures for all of them ?

Sorry it's difficult to explain just by writing, but for me the tone of each of my examples is different. That's why I was asking how each tone should sound like. A 'question rising tone' does not sound the same as a 'surprise rising tone' or a 'praise rising tone'. For me each is clearly distinct. In total there are probably more than 20 tones indicating different emotions. My question is, which ones are the more similar to the 4 tones in Mandarin.

You dont need rising tone to ask a question.
"Lai bu lai? (Come or come not?)" or "Ni lai ma? (You come 'question particle')" would do the deal.

Ok, but what about expressing surprise, etc. ? (e.g. "I have just bought two baby crocodiles" => "crocodiles ?!" )

[seasurfer]

Thanks for the explanation seasurfer. Bu what about all the other emotions I listed in my first posts ? Is there words or grammatical structures for all of them ?

Sorry it's difficult to explain just by writing, but for me the tone of each of my examples is different. That's why I was asking how each tone should sound like. A 'question rising tone' does not sound the same as a 'surprise rising tone' or a 'praise rising tone'. For me each is clearly distinct. In total there are probably more than 20 tones indicating different emotions. My question is, which ones are the more similar to the 4 tones in Mandarin.



Ok, but what about expressing surprise, etc. ? (e.g. "I have just bought two baby crocodiles" => "crocodiles ?!" )

Hi, Maciamo,

Sorry, I really don't get your question here. Are you trying to compare emotional tone in all languages to the 4 chinese tones or asking how chinese people express these emotional tones in relation to the 4 tones? If you don't mind, may you give me a simple example, so I may know your question.

[Maciamo]

Sorry, I really don't get your question here. Are you trying to compare emotional tone in all languages to the 4 chinese tones or asking how chinese people express these emotional tones in relation to the 4 tones? If you don't mind, may you give me a simple example, so I may know your question.

Yes, that is my question. Actually there are 2 questions :

1) How do Chinese people express emotional tones if tones are "fixed" for each word.

2) Which emotion fits better the 4 tones in standard Mandarin. Does a rising tone sound more like a question, a surprise or enthusiatic praise ?

Sorry it's difficult to give examples different from above as I can't write those emotional tones.

[seasurfer]

Yes, that is my question. Actually there are 2 questions :

1) How do Chinese people express emotional tones if tones are "fixed" for each word.

2) Which emotion fits better the 4 tones in standard Mandarin. Does a rising tone sound more like a question, a surprise or enthusiatic praise ?

Sorry it's difficult to give examples different from above as I can't write those emotional tones.

I would say other than tone, there is another factor in any spoken language, the strength of voice.

1) How do Chinese people express emotional tones if tones are "fixed" for each word.

Since the pronunciation of each word is fixed, people who speak mandarin usually change the strength of voice to and add or remove certain words to express the related emotion.

Example:
A harsh order: In this case, the speaker will raise his voice, making the expressed word sound serious.

Asking for help: In this case, the speaker will speak softly, showing respect toward the person.

All in all, the strenght of voice is just one factor, facial expression is another major factor. Then what about talking over the phone? Then you have to control the strength of voice.

Secondly, as I said previously, the tone are fixed, however to express emotion one simply has to change the way he/she phrase his sentence, there are many chinese word that you can add or remove in a sentene to achieve the wanted emotion.

Example:
有沒有? === Do you have it or not?
To make the sentence sound more affection, the word 啊 can be added, hence becoming 有沒有啊?
啊 has no meaning, it is just a word added to a sentence to change the emotion of the sentence.

記得! === Remember!
Again to make the sentence sound more nicely or affectionate, the word 哦 can be added. Hence becoming 記得哦!
哦 has no meaning too, it is just a word add to change the effect of a sentence.

好! ==== Fine! or Good!
To make the expression sound more nicely, a can also add 啦 in the sentence. Making it 好啦!

There are many more words that one can add to change the emotion of the sentence, of course this has to be accompanied by the strength of voice to achieve its ultimate effect. The same word can have opposite emotional meaning if the strenght of voice is different.


2) Which emotion fits better the 4 tones in standard Mandarin. Does a rising tone sound more like a question, a surprise or enthusiatic praise ?

If you use French as an example, such as:
Ca va? ==== In this case, the tone is raising, and is pretty close to the second tone of mandarin, the 35 tone.

Ca va. ==== In this case, the tone is a bit flat and a bit of going down? (some people speak it in a way that is "a bit of going up" too, some people just speak it flat.) I think it is very hard to compare this to either of the 4 chinese mandarin tones, but may be it is closer to the first tone, with a lower version of it, using the 五度標記法, change the 55 tone to a 44 tone. May be??? But 44 tone don't exist in mandarin, although the tone can be created....

Regarding surprise and enthusiatic praise, is there such kind of tone? To express surprise or enthusiatic, don't we need to phrase our sentence to achieve this effect, rather then the tone?

Let's say the expression Oh! is a surprise tone, then in Mandarin it is the same too, 哦! is also being used. In this case, 哦! is pronounced as Oh!

Let's say the enthusiatic expression is Yes! I want it!, then in Mandarin, it is also the same by say it with a higher voice or strength, 是的!我要!

Maciamo, I don't know if I had answer your question, but hopefully this will shed some light.

[Rin Daemoko]

Let's say the enthusiatic expression is Yes! I want it!, then in Mandarin, it is also the same by say it with a higher voice or strength, 是的!我要!

谢谢您！ 那是很有用的。

I'm just finishing up my Mandarin 100 class at the University (with plans to take 101 next semester). I seem to be great with the language in its written form, but speaking it is difficult for me since I'm very picky about taking the time to sound out the tones. I'm sure I sound like an instructional tape when I do.

I've taken up to Japanese 210 in University, so I have some experience with the characters 汉字 (漢字). Just my one class in Mandarin 100 has increased my understanding of these characters a great deal, which will help me a lot with further studies in the Japanese language.

I also learned that a lot of these characters were introduced to Japan by a Japanese monk who went to study Buddhism in China. Very interesting!