Assumptions that gaijin cannot speak Japanese (at all)

[studyonline]

I have this funny story. There were two Japanese students walking down on a street. They saw a gaijin coming toward them. One guy said to the other, "Hey, say something to him in English". The other guy determined for the action and waited for the moment. As the gaijin came close to them, he tried to greet and say hi. He was nervous but finally opened his mouth saying, "I..I...I..am.....PEN!"

日本人がシャイなのは、皆さんがご存知の事実です。　 特に、外人との接触する機会が� る時など彼らにとって は、何らかの心の準備が必要なほどです。　恐らく沖縄 、大阪、東京以外の県では、外人を見かけるチャンスは 余り� りません。　沖縄だと外人住宅が近接していて殆ど どの大通りでも、外人を見かけることができます。　基 地に住んでいるアメリカ兵などは、よく付近の町に遊び に出かけます。　ハンビータウンと呼ばれる所では、その３０％の人々が外人だと 、私は思います。　

そんなインターナショナル的環境に� る今日の日本ですが、日本人が、 外人に対してどのようにして応じたら良いかといった、 身近で大きな壁が� るという現実は、見逃せません。　 　そもそも私達日本人は、「外人」という言葉にだまさ れて、自分たちも外人の内で� るというのに気付いてい ません。　　彼らの日本国の位置は、世界の中心に� り ます。　だから、全て他の国からの外人たちは、彼らに とって「外の人」なのです。　
Gaijin as you know means "out-siders." Many of them do not think out-siders can do what Japanese can. That's why they will look at you like a rare item when you use chopsticks and eat rice. They may die of a heart-attack if you do 落語 in front of them. The problem is really the lack of knowledge on other cultures and people in the world as well as the lack of 身近な経験　with the foreigners.

[Mikawa Ossan]

Good morning!

I know Maciamo can fend for himself, but I feel that he's getting a lot of undue bad feelings for something that I started. Of course, I'm referring to "the Weather Incident". So I've decided to gather all of the pertinent posts up to the point the misunderstanding got out of hand.

Somewhere down the line, I came to the realization that many times the people saying these things are just trying to make conversation. They're not REALLY surprised at the fact that you can use chopsticks, but they think it's a safe topic to start conversation. It's like talking about the weather, in that sense.

Sometimes such remarks come after I have known the person for a while and we have already discussed about many things.

I know this is not about the weather incident, but it was part of a reply to my post that everyone seemed to miss.

I could apply your argument to absolutely anything. If someone said to me "nice weather today", should I in the same way feel upset and insulted because I've been living on this earth for 32 years, and I'm intelligent enough to know for myself if the weather is good or not. And they should be well aware of that.

This is where the trouble starts.

Not really. When someone say "nice weather today", they just want to share their present feelings, or ask for a confirmation from the other party. Note that weather is independent from any party involved. It is different from complimenting somebody on things that do not need compliment, and thus making them feel awkard.

Maciamo is making a distinction here between the weather and "conversational" compliments. I got the impression that by making this distinction Maciamo was intending to express that he would NOT get offended by talk of the weather. This point seemed to have been missed, and after this point, things seemed to have gone bad.

I hope this straightens out the "Weather Incident". Please understand that Maciamo is NOT saying that he would get insulted by talk of the weather. The point was originally brought up as a rhetorical device by Silverpoint, and Maciamo responded by (indirectly) saying that it was an invalid point.

[Maciamo]

He was nervous but finally opened his mouth saying, "I..I...I..am.....PEN!"

Do you mean the 'gaijin' said that ? If that is the case, it was probably a joke, as I have heard countless times Japanese who couldn't speak English shout to me in the street "This is a pen !" because that's all they could remember from their English class (and by the way, we don't start English classes with "this is a pen" or such nonsense in Europe).

日本人がシャイなのは、皆さんがご存知の事実です。　 特に、外人との接触する機会が� る時など彼らにとって は、何らかの心の準備が必要なほどです。

I will reply in English so that everybody can understand. I am also a rather shy person. Probably shier than most Japanese, which I found to be as expressive and open as the Italians- at least between themselves. Whta I don't understand is why most (if not all) Japanese behave so much differently when meeting Westerners. Why does a normal person suddenly become shy when they have to deal with a foreigner ? When I go to the combini, sometimes the staff is so nervous when I ask them something in Japanese (e.g. コピー機を使っていいですか？=> May I use the photocopier ?) that I can see them trembling in fear, and some cannot find their words to reply and call for help (gaijin da ! gaijin da !). Fortunately, this happens only once out of 50 times, but it does happen. And that is in cental Tokyo (e.g. Nihombashi) where there are Westerners going to that combini maybe 10 times a day. We can't even say they are not used to dealing with foreigners ! The funny thing is that it's almost always young males (in their 20's) or older women (over 50 years old) that panick at the sight of a Westerner. I may understand the latter, but not the former. Where is the proud and strong samuari spirit of the young Japanese men ?

Where I come from (Belgian countryside), we almost never see foreigners (much less than in any Japanese city, even small country towns). It is close to 100% white. But nobody panicks, behaves differently, or say "help, that's a foreigner ! I can't speak English !". It makes absolutely no difference. I have travelled all around Europe with my (Japanese) wife, even in small country towns with no foreigners, and never have people behaved strangely like with 'gaijin' in Japan.

Gaijin as you know means "out-siders." Many of them do not think out-siders can do what Japanese can.

Thanks for confirming what I have been explaining.

They may die of a heart-attack if you do 落語 in front of them. The problem is really the lack of knowledge on other cultures and people in the world as well as the lack of 身近な経験　with the foreigners.

I doubt that the lack 身近な経験 (close-contact experience) be the real reason. As I said, where I come from, most people have probably never had close contact experience with a Japanese or a non white. But my wife can go in anywhere (shop, supermarket, train station...) and nobody even tries to speak something else but French, except when they see she doesn't understand, so they may try English if they can. Nobody assumes that because she is not white she can't do things as well as locals. This is called racism.

What's more, the area where I live in Tokyo is very central and I see many Westerners everyday. I see them at my local supermarket, in restaurants or bento-ya in my area, etc. and yet some locals (older men, especially during matsuri when they are a bit more uninhibited) will shout "hey America !" or "This is a pen" when seeing a Westerner. This would never happen in Belgium. There are many Morrocans in Brussels (the capital) but it would be considered very racist to shout Arabic-sounding things that do not mean anything or shout "Hey Morroco !" when seeing one. Nobody does it (afaik).