The Unbiased Truth About Nova

[Glenski]

Yeah seriously, WTF is wrong with a drug test?

Well, how would you feel if only a certain type of people were required to take the drug test? Let's be creative:

Only people with blue eyes.
Only people that are left-handed.
Only people that have a certain blood type.

Pretty discriminatory, wouldn't you say?

Ok, now let's talk about the REAL story. The NOVA teachers are the only ones at that company who have the drug testing clause in their contracts. None of the Japanese employees do. DISCRIMINATION.

THAT'S what's wrong with the drug testing.

[pipokun]

...
Legality of discrimination? Discrimination is illegal, as evidenced by Japan signing the 1995 anti-discrimination treaty. HOWEVER, as you pointed out, the rub is that Japan has not followed up on that by enacting any laws to put teeth into the treaty.
...

Yes, some LDP members and the ruling coalitions have been eager to enact the controversial human right law for years.
I bet the current gaijin right activists will turn "no more highly controlled society" activists after the enactment.

[KirinMan]

Ok, now let's talk about the REAL story. The NOVA teachers are the only ones at that company who have the drug testing clause in their contracts. None of the Japanese employees do. DISCRIMINATION.
THAT'S what's wrong with the drug testing.

While I agree that is is discriminatory in theory, it appears to me that the only employees of NOVA to be "caught" using or possessing illegal drugs are it's "foreign" staff. I have not heard of any of their Japanese staff being caught or arrested for breaking the drug laws here in Japan.

I agree that it should (NOVA) have the same rules for all of it's employees

Howver, I wonder if for example the coaching staffs of any NFL, MLB, NBA, NHL, (sorry for those that are unfamiliar with the acronyms, National Football League, Major League Baseball, National Basketball Association, or National Hockey League), in the US are tested for illegal drugs as well. What about any soccer league? Do they test for illegal drugs? If they do do the staff and administration get tested as well?

What about the coaching staffs and mangers of any Olympic team? Do they get tested after every event? I doubt it.

THe NOVA teachers are the "kanban" or sign-board front of the company, they are the "athletes" that make or break the company and when their "stars" go or get out of line it is rather easy to understand the company's position in making "testing" a part of their organization.

One other thing, any "new" employee of NOVA is notified of this testing procedure before they are hired, so if anyone has a problem with it there is no need for them to accept employment with them.

I have a hard time with understanding people that know the rules and regulations ahead of being hired and then bitching about them afterwards. If they didn't like it in the first place there was no need for them to accept the job in the first place.

[DoctorP]

One other thing, any "new" employee of NOVA is notified of this testing procedure before they are hired, so if anyone has a problem with it there is no need for them to accept employment with them.

I have a hard time with understanding people that know the rules and regulations ahead of being hired and then bitching about them afterwards. If they didn't like it in the first place there was no need for them to accept the job in the first place.

Very well said...It is amazing how common sense is thrown out the window sometimes isn't it!

[Ewok85]

The floodgates open!

Sooo glad I'm as far away from the English teaching circuit as you can possibly get. I'm hoping for a removal of English as a compulsory topic by 2010.

[KirinMan]

. I'm hoping for a removal of English as a compulsory topic by 2010.

Never happen in fact it will most likely become a compulsory subject in ALL elementary schools here in Japan maybe by that time.

NOVA exists because of the failings of the current way of teaching compulsory English. What I would rather see is NOVA disappear along with all the rest of the "eikaiwa's", which wont happen either I'm afraid.

Even if NOVA folds someone somewhere here will step up and fill in their shoes.

[senseiman]

Yeah, I'm glad I got out of English teaching too. I imagine if and when NOVA folds the market will be flooded with teachers.

[Sukotto]

Yeah, I'm glad I got out of English teaching too. I imagine if and when NOVA folds the market will be flooded with teachers.

I better hurry then,
since i am philosophically opposed to a college degree (for myself, even
though i am like 2/3 through),
it might be my last best chance to be able to live there for a while.

I know all private English language schools, including NOVA, have a policy
of hiring teachers only with a 4 year college degree, but I've read stuff
in internet/rumor land that one might be able to work part-time.
Then with over time make up the difference for survival.

[Elizabeth]

I better hurry then,
since i am philosophically opposed to a college degree (for myself, even
though i am like 2/3 through),
it might be my last best chance to be able to live there for a while.
I know all private English language schools, including NOVA, have a policy
of hiring teachers only with a 4 year college degree, but I've read stuff
in internet/rumor land that one might be able to work part-time.
Then with over time make up the difference for survival.

If you get more interested in the language, going over for a year of study would be another option. It may be prohibitively expensive and even less flexible in terms of eligibility, but there's always the possibility of looking for a teaching position or other PT work within the confines of a roof over your head and a guaranteed meal or two a day.

If the Japanese government does not come to NOVA's rescue in the next several months and it is either 'allowed' to shut down or goes through a major downsizing I'd say in the short term it's a total waste of time to apply without a degree. More reputable eikaiwas would likely start raising their standards by requiring MAs or TEFL degrees at the same time they're lowering salaries, increasing hours and letting go of older teachers to take advantage of the supply/demand imbalance.

Over the longer term of course NOVA could go under and come back under a different name or a variety of smaller, equally suspect, if not shadier, firms could spring up to absorb the glut. Then you'd absolutely have to burn the midnight oil to make up any difference.

It'll be really interesting to see how this all plays out by the end of the year.

[Ewok85]

Yeah, I'm glad I got out of English teaching too. I imagine if and when NOVA folds the market will be flooded with teachers.

But these people aren't "teachers" - working in an eikaiwa using fixed lessons based on textbooks with classes of 3 or less people, a vast majority of these people have not studied education or have any qualifications in education.

If anything it will flood the market with untrained and on the whole inexperienced (as the majority of NOVA people that I know are fresh graduates) foreigners - some of which will find work as ALT's, but those who are doing what I consider "serious" teaching (ie. direct hire) won't be bothered.

But then there is always the question of will the employers care? Would they rather someone who is educated, trained and experienced as a teacher of ESL, or someone who will work for less but doesn't have the same experience? Money is a factor too.

but I've read stuff in internet/rumor land

Not a rumour - a fact. To be able to work more than one year (if you are British, Canadian, Australian) you need to have completed a degree from a registered college or university. And its not NOVA's choice, its the governments order.

Why on earth would you be philosophically opposed to a degree? Its a tool that you can use to get the type of job in Japan that you want, if you can get one then go for it, otherwise your options are pretty limited.

I am not the greatest advocate of tertiary education either. For example I only went to University for one year, completed the most advanced Japanese course available.... then quit. There was nothing left for me. Meanwhile I was expected to study, and pay a fair amount too, so I would have enough "credit" to be able to study and pay for more subjects I have no interest in, etc. I also did a computer science course, found it to be total dribble, was denied being allowed to study 2nd year material, so refused to go to lectures and only turned up for the exam.

I know plenty of CS graduates, most of which don't have any real world experience at using a computer, and just have theory that in the real world is pretty much useless unless you want to go back and teach CS. They would be better off just making them read technical whitepapers than the stuff they already teach.

[Sukotto]

Not a rumour - a fact. To be able to work more than one year (if you are British, Canadian, Australian) you need to have completed a degree from a registered college or university. And its not NOVA's choice, its the governments order.

I meant a rumor that one might be able to get on at NOVA w/out the degree.

I've heard it was gov't law for any gov't run institution for 4yr college degree requirement.
But I did not know it was law for private run institutions. I just
thought it was their policy.

[Ewok85]

I meant a rumor that one might be able to get on at NOVA w/out the degree.
I've heard it was gov't law for any gov't run institution for 4yr college degree requirement.
But I did not know it was law for private run institutions. I just
thought it was their policy.

It hasn't got the slightest thing to do with the company - its all about immigration. No degree, no work visa. No work visa - no work.

[Elizabeth]

If anything it will flood the market with untrained and on the whole inexperienced (as the majority of NOVA people that I know are fresh graduates) foreigners - some of which will find work as ALT's, but those who are doing what I consider "serious" teaching (ie. direct hire) won't be bothered.

I imagine quite a lot of these NOVA folks -- particularly the younger, fresher inexperienced graduates at the bottom end -- will simply end up leaving Japan if their branch closes. Their only other competitive options may be to wait around for one of the other large eikaiwas to expand or work for bottom rock wages at a startup. And there will almost certainly be greater govt. regulation and oversight of anyone that comes up to fill the hole than there has been on the industry until this point.

Although I personally rather suspect the company isn't going anywhere in the short term, and that a much smaller, leaner, hopefully nicer , more student-oriented NOVA will still be around in some form come next January. Whether it will still be under the same management, recruiting out of its overseas offices, hiring at all for that matter, and how many of its some 500,000 students will be looking for another teacher are the real acid test questions we'll all be looking to guage and endlessly analyze over the next few weeks and months.

[senseiman]

Why on earth would you be philosophically opposed to a degree? Its a tool that you can use to get the type of job in Japan that you want, if you can get one then go for it, otherwise your options are pretty limited.

The main problem for you is that the normal avenue for non-degree holders, the working holiday visa, isn't available to Americans. I say go finish that 1/3 of the degree you've got left.

Also, about that "4 year degree" requirement, if you've got a 3 year degree then they'll still take you. I had a 3 year undergraduate degree from a Canadian university and I was hired by both GEOS and AEON despite that fact without any trouble.

[Sukotto]

Why on earth would you be philosophically opposed to a degree? Its a tool that you can use to get the type of job in Japan that you want, if you can get one then go for it, otherwise your options are pretty limited.
The main problem for you is that the normal avenue for non-degree holders, the working holiday visa, isn't available to Americans. I say go finish that 1/3 of the degree you've got left.
Also, about that "4 year degree" requirement, if you've got a 3 year degree then they'll still take you. I had a 3 year undergraduate degree from a Canadian university and I was hired by both GEOS and AEON despite that fact without any trouble.

US has 2yr Associates degrees.
and working holiday visas for Americans?
these people are too crazy, as the following may attest to:


oh, boy,
are you ready for this one?


you're all going to totally rip this apart, i know.
i'll try my best. i never put it "on paper", so to speak.
just had varying ideas going around in my head for a number of years.
and, if i list spell them out to you, it might be the end of it and might just
wind up getting one after all because a) you might convince me otherwise; or b) whenever i say i am going to do something, i often do not do it.
so here the opposite.

my very first semester in attending university was a 2nd semester and the school i went to wasn't that big so the first Japanese language course was not taught during this semester. i'd had it in high school and my Japanese teacher suggested why don't i go to college for Japanese after he learned i didn't really have any plans after high school. i could get a degree in anything and go to Japan to teach English. so Japanese language was
the primary reason i went after taking a couple years off not really thinking too much about attending during that time.
that was what got me to go in the first place. had it not been for Japanese language, i would not have gone to college at all.
with my first semester not having Japanese, when it was almost done i almost failed to make the minimum required gpa because one particular course i'd just about given up on. i didn't really want to be there any way and i'm not taking the courses i wanted, so why should i be there? an adviser convinced me to go talk to one prof about the particular class. so i remained in college.

even though i really had my doubts about wanting to be there at all.
i felt college was for the rich people.
why should i get to be a privileged shmuck?
maybe i could become an "expert" and tell other people the way
things should be or how they should live their lives?
that seemed kind of immoral to me.
for instance, i don't want to become a social worker and tell some kid they had better shape up or face the consequences. coercion.

and the whole "IQ" test thing is culturally biased.
"so we college graduates are smart because we have these
degrees that show a mastery of set of knowledge X."
which whom deems that particular knowledge important?
generally speaking, groups that control more of the planets resources
than the rest.

those with the degree should get paid more money because those
that control most of the resources(money) deem that particular set
of knowledge valuable. why? because it helps them keep control
of the resources, of course. share a little more of those resources
with with those (degree/knowledge holders) that can use their cleverness to help maintain the resources in the hands of the few.


and if you are not able to obtain enough of the pre-determined set
of knowledge that is good at helping maintain the resources in the hands that they are, you should just get less resources of the earth. or so it is determined by those (we allow) to lay claim to a disproportionate amount of the earth's limited resources.
the earth is not an endless resource, therefore, the theory that a "rising tide of economic goodness will raise all ships" is rather incorrect.
only so much can be "re-invested" in resource extraction, the source of all real wealth -the earth, because there is only so much resources to extract.
simply adding some numbers to current numbers and "inventing" more value or wealth is a flaming joke; a house of cards ready to crumble when it goes on too long.

that's also a sort of time line of ideas as i obtained or contemplated them. (perhaps poorly)

so,
college is primarily about the restocking of the ruling class.

at least in a society with such disparities in wealth as the US,
despite the idea of "class" being well hidden behind ideology and rhetoric.


today,
the ruling class primarily hides their privilege behind the legal protections
of the corporation. not only privilege in disproportionate access to the earth's resources, including the resources in other peoples' countries which are actually a particular people's first and foremost, but also the privileges that the legal form called the corporation constructs, such as limited liability for the owners/shareholders, among others. these privileges were primarily constructed over the past century, century and a half.



and criticizing corporations i've found out, not in a collge class, but in extra-curicular activities, is not a "communist" endeavor:
"I hope we shall take warning from the example and crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country."
said (Letter to Logan, 1816). THOMAS JEFFERSON

“I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country. . . . corporations have been enthroned and an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working upon the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed.”
– U.S. President Abraham Lincoln, Nov. 21, 1864

and the patron saint of capitalism
Adam Smith condemned corporations for their effect in curtailing "natural liberty."


so blah, blah, blah,
the us is the belly of the beast.

something bad was going to happen but we didn't know what.
well, lots bad was already happening coming from dc, but mostly
didn't affect people in the US so much.
then the US flat out invaded 2 countries,
dropping the war by proxy and usual low-intensity warfare of arming dictators and death squads (read Pinochets & Contras).
(low-intensity meaning attacking civilians; not very low-intensity for those it was aimed at: unionist/worker rights advocates, church groups, community groups, democratic organizers, etc...)


and maybe cute Japanese girls almost got me to leave this trash heap.
but thanks to others who are much smarter than i, this did not happen.



regarding going to Japan without a degree to try to get a job,
i also thought this not such a good thing because
one should respect the requirements of one's host.
i mean, "white males", be they wealthy land holders or not,
have historically gotten their way throughout history.
so here lies a very good reason, imo, to not try to weasel one's
way into a job in Japan without a degree.


yeah, yeah, sounds nice.
so who wants to give me a job?
not


yeah,
that about sums it up.
and going to Japan is an escape from this reality.
so, yeah.
forget about it.
at least for now.
lame-duck presidents still might claim they have a legal power
to attack Iran. impeachment is the least we can do for the rest
of the world; for those that live on the periferary of the empire,
to say we are sorry. will that happen? or are too many of us,
myself included, addicted to American Idle?
if only i'd stop sitting in front of this damn screen!

[Bucko]

I'm so glad I got out when I did. Getting that final pay cheque last month was a big relief, now all I have to worry about are my friends that are still there. Poor buggers. English teaching in Japan is such a joke. Now that I'm actually at a properly managed, legitimate Japanese language school with properly qualified teachers, I look back to the "English teaching" days as something of a complete sham. Teachers who get very little training, teachers who hardly understand the workings of English, let alone being able to teach it, students who don't question or challenge you, it's just a joke. I don't know why they make students learn English at school for four years. Language is a thing that takes years upon years to learn. Either make English a subject compulsary from the first grade of school, or get rid of it completely.

[Iron Chef]

It's amusing to read some of these replies... I take myself and my craft seriously. I've been self-employed and owner/operator of my own language school for a couple years now. And I am very successful at it. In fact, I have turned away students and new contracts now for the last six months simply because there aren't enough hours in the day for me anymore.

Anybody can call themselves an "English teacher" but the ones who willingly dedicate their time and patience to commit themselves to helping a student progress are few and far between. NOVA dropped the ball on that one. Like most of the major eikawa, it was all about the signups. Getting them into the system was/is their only real priority. Student care and aggressively helping students to achieve the goals they set out for themselves fell along the wayside.

Oh well, more business for me I suppose should I choose to take it up lol. If I told you the number of current eikawa branch school managers and teachers I teach atm (NOVA, AEON, GEOS, ECC, etc.) as my own students you'd all be surprised... Guess it just shows that even the company employees don't have faith in their own system anymore.

Expect to see more entrepreneurs like myself stepping up to fill in the void. I don't do contracts with students, I let them pay me monthly on the same day every month or they can opt for a pay-as-you-go rate per lesson/class. There are no extra fees or additional charges tacked on. EVER. There is no penalty for makeups or having to cancel a class (with reasonable notice). And there are no stipulations or penalties about deciding to leave should the student feel dissatisfied with their progress/instruction for whatever reason. In other words, I do everything NOVA doesn't.

[senseiman]

It's amusing to read some of these replies... I take myself and my craft seriously. I've been self-employed and owner/operator of my own language school for a couple years now. And I am very successful at it. In fact, I have turned away students and new contracts now for the last six months simply because there aren't enough hours in the day for me anymore.
Anybody can call themselves an "English teacher" but the ones who willingly dedicate their time and patience to commit themselves to helping a student progress are few and far between. NOVA dropped the ball on that one. Like most of the major eikawa, it was all about the signups. Getting them into the system was/is their only real priority. Student care and aggressively helping students to achieve the goals they set out for themselves fell along the wayside.
Oh well, more business for me I suppose should I choose to take it up lol. If I told you the number of current eikawa branch school managers and teachers I teach atm (NOVA, AEON, GEOS, ECC, etc.) as my own students you'd all be surprised... Guess it just shows that even the company employees don't have faith in their own system anymore.
Expect to see more entrepreneurs like myself stepping up to fill in the void. I don't do contracts with students, I let them pay me monthly on the same day every month or they can opt for a pay-as-you-go rate per lesson/class. There are no extra fees or additional charges tacked on. EVER. There is no penalty for makeups or having to cancel a class (with reasonable notice). And there are no stipulations or penalties about deciding to leave should the student feel dissatisfied with their progress/instruction for whatever reason. In other words, I do everything NOVA doesn't.

That is awesome. I spent a couple of years doing pretty much the exact same thing, ie teaching students on my own out of my apartment. I don't know if I would call it a "school", though we did have an room set up as a class. Like you I only charged students monthly and never had any formal contracts. It worked out great for me too, it was the best time I had in Japan.

You seem to view the (potential) collapse of NOVA as a good thing. I don't think it is a good thing for the private operator though. I always thought it was useful to have the big schools around because you could easily undercut their prices (which are outrageous) while offering even better service. They serve a pretty useful function in creating demand for English lessons (through their marketing, etc) and in soaking up teachers (I note that some object to the use of that word to describe NOVA employees but I find that attitude a bit condescending).

If NOVA goes under the market will be flooded by teachers. This will probably have a lot of consequences for the small operator, who may face more competition from ex-NOVA teachers. Unlike competing with NOVA itself, which charges ludicrous rates, these teachers will offer private lessons at a reasonable rate.

Of course, the other effect of a NOVA collapse will be a bunch of students without a school. The problem though is that a lot of those students probably won't just go to another English school, but will just quit altogether. A lot of them were probably just brought into English lessons by the NOVA marketing machine and, without that, they'll probably loose their interest.

So the bottom line will be less demand for English lessons with more English teachers offering lessons for lower prices. Thats a tough market.

[bakaKanadajin]

The CEO said he wasn't thinking about stepping down. He may not be under any heat to do so yet, but who knows, the media and executives are old hands at the attack and save-face game. He may be packing up his bearer bonds and heading for the back door as I type this, you just can't tell.

I don't think the market for Eikaiwas is necessarily going anywhere. It's not as if thousands of really busy people have time to undertake a serious curriculum and start seeing a private teacher. The whole concept of being able to sign into a class and practice what you already know or just keep up your skills is still desirable.

It's a trade-off though, if you want convenient lessons (let's say Nova's anytime/anywhere policy did work) what degree of personalization could you expect if you were seeing a different teacher all the time and coming in last minute? Many times I've planned a lesson to the T only to have some bloody sign-in who's already done the lesson screw everything up. All my quick-thinking goes out the window and I have to do something less interesting to accomodate this individual who can't commit to a schedule in advance.

NOVA has to do a lot to improve its customer service first of all, and then its curriculum and teaching standards, etc. but I think sometimes the whole concept of some Japanese people taking English as a hobby and 'accessorizing' their life with it also plays a role in creating the problems. Learning is a serious undertaking that requires home-study and practice, many students at Eikaiwas don't do this.

[Iron Chef]

Learning is a serious undertaking that requires home-study and practice, many students at Eikaiwas don't do this.

Amen to that. Serious students have to take it upon themselves and abandon the notion that no matter how much they pay, going once or twice a week for 50 minutes at a time to learn English but then leaving it at the door when you leave will get you nowhere. At any rate, NOVA will have some to spin some serious damage control I suspect. Will be interesting to see how they deal with the fallout of the decision against them.

[Bucko]

I've never quite understood the whole "I want to study English conversation" thing. Surely a well rounded process of grammar, vocab, plus speaking practice is much better overall than the rubbish people learn at "conversation schools". I saw so many students over the years who complain that their grammar, spelling, writing, well, pretty much everything, was bad. "It's no wonder" I thought, you come here and repeat a few lame situational phrases from a monkey, and you expect to be learning?

Seriously, without bragging, I've been studying Japanese for two and a half years, and I'm pretty sure that my ability in every single area, except for maybe vocab, is better than many of the "high level" students at Nova, who have been "studying" English for 5, 10 years plus.

I've just recently heard the phrase "English fetish", which might be part of the reason. I.e., it's not important to be able to communicate properly, or even really learn the language. The primary goal is to be able to coin up some random phrases to satisfy some weird desire to, well, be able to coin up random phrases. In fact, if 95% of all English schools were shut down then the country would still function with no problem. I laugh when I hear reasons like "because English is the global language". Haha, like that's their (maybe 80% of "student's") real reason. 80% of the people studying English in Japan (which is like 5% of the population or something) don't need English. If they did then there wouldn't be so many bad students, and they'd realise they're not learning it properly and demand higher quality lessons, higher quality content etc so that they actually COULD get access to English information sources. No, their true reason is to fulfill that weird fetish to be able to speak a few random, useless phrases, maybe to look cool or intelligent or something.

[Elizabeth]

I've never quite understood the whole "I want to study English conversation" thing. Surely a well rounded process of grammar, vocab, plus speaking practice is much better overall than the rubbish people learn at "conversation schools". I saw so many students over the years who complain that their grammar, spelling, writing, well, pretty much everything, was bad. "It's no wonder" I thought, you come here and repeat a few lame situational phrases from a monkey, and you expect to be learning?

The emphasis on learning is slight because these schools realize most students are coming for decidedly unacademic reasons. They want to meet foreigners, socialize, experience something different, get out of the house, etc...which makes for an expensive hobby but isn't necessarily anything condemnable once you understand it isn't likely they'll ever either need to use or even have the opportunity to practice speaking English outside of class.

Of course at NOVA things were always done a bit different, and always a bit more underhanded....no hanging out with instructors, so we'll have to con students into enrolling as a way to find more Japanese friends (remember that "NOVA tomo" ad ?!). Hilarious !!

[bakaKanadajin]

I've never quite understood the whole "I want to study English conversation" thing. Surely a well rounded process of grammar, vocab, plus speaking practice is much better overall than the rubbish people learn at "conversation schools". I saw so many students over the years who complain that their grammar, spelling, writing, well, pretty much everything, was bad. "It's no wonder" I thought, you come here and repeat a few lame situational phrases from a monkey, and you expect to be learning?

I have to agree and disagree here. You're right that learning 'English conversation' as your one and only means of becoming proficient in English is flawed. Learning phrases by rote completely avoids the inner structures that allow one to create ones own language. Being able to tailor your skills to participate in different situations is made easier by figuring out how to 'think' in another language, and that only comes through analyzing grammar and seeing the thought processes behind it, its logic.

However in the defense of some Eikaiwa students and also myself, once you have learned those key grammar points and built your vocabulary into something fairly well-rounded, knowing how to naturally execute a conversation is a challenge. Most people who show up on the door step of Eikaiwas are quite well-versed in grammar but simply don't have the ability to immerse themselves in English to the degree that they're thinking in English and producing it naturally. They think in Japanese and produce something thats English but still not intelligible to a native speaker. All my theory and studying didn't amount to anything the first time I tried to have a conversation, using language is different from studying it.

Seriously, without bragging, I've been studying Japanese for two and a half years, and I'm pretty sure that my ability in every single area, except for maybe vocab, is better than many of the "high level" students at Nova, who have been "studying" English for 5, 10 years plus.

I too have been studying for a very short time (around 1 year) and I also seem to be ahead of my peers in terms of my reading, writing and speaking ability. I would wager that you and I delved quite deeply into our grammar books and dictionaries, I know I did, and that our progress wouldn't be as far along if we'd relied solely on a Barron's or LonelyPlanet phrase book. So again I agree with you there, rote-learning isn't the way to go.

But another commonly overlooked skill is listening. I'd go so far as to say listening is just as important, if not slightly more so, than speaking. Conversations go both ways and listening at a near native-speaker level is paramount. As a former teacher I can adjust my speech to suit the level of anyone from a beginner to an advanced person, but most regular individuals won't do that. Listening and processing quickly is a hard thing to improve at. Again, being in an immersive environment is the only way to achieve this, and the Eikaiwa or some form of 'conversational coaching' becomes necessary. My language exchange partners are a valuable part of my learning process at the moment.

[Bucko]

Interesting discussion. I'd just like to add that I'm not totally against the "Nova way". In fact, I'd actually quite like to take Japanese lessons in the Nova style because, as bakaKanadajin says, being able to tailor your skills to participate in different situations is made easier by figuring out how to 'think' in another language.

Most people who show up on the door step of Eikaiwas are quite well-versed in grammar

I'd have to disagree with you here. I'd have to say that, even though these people have been "taught" grammar, they don't actually know it. They either forget it quickly, or consider it unimportant, thus never learning it from the beginning. The Eikaiwa companies actually use this mentality to sell their product too, telling people that they "don't need grammar", thus people end up not being too concerned about it, which turns into a viscious cirlce. Whether it was the Eikaiwas who started this philosophy to get lazy people to sign up, or whether the lazy people wanted a different way to learn is not really clear though. Nevertheless, that's the mentality. Also, if you look at the quality of many of these student's written English, you'll see that grammar learning has been severely neglected, so I don't believe that most people are well-versed in grammar. Which again supports my (pretty understandable) belief that only a well-rounded learning process of Nova-like conversation, plus decent, solid grammar study will get these students anywhere. If, however, they are simply the types that have the so-called "English fetish" then by all means they should simply go to Nova and not worry about anything else. But they're not allowed to complain that their English sux

[Ewok85]

You should have studied English in college, might make your posts easier to read.