Your praise comes a bit late, since he already got the boot.Originally Posted by t4r00
1.1 Housing : I have been refused accommodation because I was a foreigner
1.2 Housing : My company provides my accommodation (so no problem)
1.3 Housing : I have only stayed at gaijin houses, hotels or friends' houses
1.4 Housing : I have lived in Japan for many years, rented my housing via a estate agent, and never had any problem
1.5 Housing : I have only stayed in Japan for two years or less, rented my housing via a estate agent, but never had any problem
2.1 Tourism : I have been refused entry to a hotel, guesthouse or weekly mansion because I was a foreigner
2.2 Tourism : I have stayed a few times in hotels, guesthouses and/or weekly mansions and have never been refused entry
2.3 Tourism : I have stayed numerous times in hotels, guesthouses and/or weekly mansions and have never been refused entry
3.1 Entertainment : I have been refused entry to at least one restaurant, bar, nightclub, onsen or public bath because I was a foreigner
3.2 Entertainment : I have been a few times to restaurants, bars, nightclubs, onsen or public baths, and was never refused entry
3.3 Entertainment : I have been a hundreds of times to restaurants, bars, nightclubs, onsen or public baths, and was never refused entry
4.1 Police : I have been stopped and asked for an ID (passport/alien registration) by the police for no reason
4.2 Police : I have been stopped while riding a bicycle and had my bike registration checked during day time for no reason
4.3 Police : I have been stopped while riding a bicycle and had my bike registration checked during night time for no reason
4.4 Police : I have been mistakenly arrested (taken to the police station)
4.5 Police : I have had other discriminatory problems with the police
4.6 Police : I have stayed for many years in Japan and have never been checked or annoyed by the police in Japan
4.7 Police : I have stayed less than 2 years in Japan and have never been checked or annoyed by the police in Japan
5.1 Sexual Discrimination : I have experienced sexual harassment in Japan
5.2 Sexual Discrimination : I have experienced sexual discrimination regarding promotion, salary or opportunity
5.3 Sexual Discrimination : I am not a woman or have never worked in a Japanese company
Your praise comes a bit late, since he already got the boot.
Is this " Japanese ONLY " business practice restricted in Tokyo metropolitan area or it's wide spread through out Japan islands ?
How about neighborhood family-owned restaurants where other NE Asians or Westerners might pop in for a quick meal,do some of these have " Japanese ONLY " sign as well ?
As for the 1st, No except in a legit sense.
As for the 2nd, I've never seen like that before.
I would recommend that anyone coming to Japan thinks about it well before taking the plunge and coming here.I mean if youve got a japanese girlfriend and you have travelled extensively then japan is heaven.Its so safe,people are friendly and there is money everywhere and everyone seems to have it.The problem is that it is a very traditional country and if you are not with somebody japanese then you might (actually WILL) feel like an outsider.Hope that helps..Anyone can make the best out of any given situation and the Japanese are top people..Really!
I don't know where you are from, but I rarely had the impression that "there was money everywhere and everyone seems to have it" while I was in Japan. This may be true of the few rich neighbourhoods of Tokyo like Ginza and Marunouchi (indeed where most tourists go), but once you go to the suburbs, or worse, the countryside, my feeling was almost always like I was in a developing country like Thailand (Thailand is definitely the most similar I can think of), with just 10 or 20 years of economic head-start. I suppose it is especially the houses (or hovels), old and cheap-looking taxis, or run-down and poorily lit shops owned by elderly people that made me feel like that. Most of the real estate agencies, pharmacies or clothes shops in my shitamachi neighbourhood of Tokyo looked so old, cheap or run-down that I would just pass my way and look for another one, had I seen them in Europe.
I guess that is why Westerners in Japan usually stick to the "expensive" neighbourhoods of big cities (Azabu, Shirokane, Yoyogi...) and shop in places like Shinjuku, Ebisu, Roppongi Hills, Ginza or Marunouchi. Westerners rarely come to Japan to live in places like Akita or Miyazaki, unless they have to (because that is their girlfriend's hometown or because the JET programme send them there).
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Posts deleted, I edited the post, while I needed to delete it in the first place.
So I did now, and that made the other post irrelevant. Sorry for the mistake.. please continue with the topic
I think I was on the flight that had the videos.
I had an easy go in Japan, the only time I was refused access anywhere was to a nightclub and its because I didn't have proper ID. My alien card was in the process of being replaced.. all I had was the slip of blue paper that replaces it in the mean time. Whether they wouldn't accept it because I was a gaijin is hard to determine, but I know that even here in Toronto they won't accept fascimiles from anyone, native-born or not. I would assume that because it was a hip hop club and there are a lot of reckless vacationers looking to party and go nuts in Tokyo, the strictness of their policy was definitely justified.
A friend of mine was once greeted at an izakaya by the mama-san crossing her arms in a giant 'X' and going 'gaijin NO, gaijin NO'.
My ex had trouble getting her own apartment without a guarantor, but several other NOVA teachers did not.
It's really a case by case basis, I think on average if you display even the slightest courtesy and consideration for 'the Japanese way', whatever that amounts to at that particular time or in that particular situation, you'll find that attitudes will soften. Of course in some cases that just doesn't work but I think that's the exception not the rule.
There are some things which are sacred to Japanese culture and their way of life. For example conduct at onsens, certain eateries and establishments, certain services; things and places where you don't want to put up with someone else's learning curve. Since Canada is less then 2 centuries old I don't think we have any places worth kicking people out of, but I can understand how a culture as old as Japan's might.
Wow! Haha... I can't vote. Isn't the one on "sexual discrimination" a bit biased? I have worked for a Japanese company, am a woman, and did not feel any sexual discrimination...so I go to check that option...there's no option! Only "I have experienced sexual discrimination" twice and then an option for "I am not a woman"! I see the poller has made up his mind ;)
I have lots of discrimination experiences but none regarding refusing entry. I've had people refuse to even consider me for a job because I'm foreign and I have tons of bad experiences with people yelling racist epithets at me, treating me like a criminal, stereotyping me, or making my experience miserable in general. But nothing on this poll, really, perhaps because of my Japanese husband? One thing to be thankful for.
And wow at some of the posts of people defending discriminatory practices! Amazing...
I can't understand your taking exception to people taking notice of and treating you differently because of your race and gender. After all, it is by those two things alone that you choose to be known to us, "White Girl".
You can't understand me being angry at people yelling racial epithets at me for no reason, because of my username? Good lord.
Actually, my name was meant to refer sarcastically to the fact that it's the most important thing in my life right now, at least to everyone I meet. I thought it was funny...maybe I have a warped sense of humour...
Actually though I could care less about race. My nephew asked me why my skin is so white, I thought it was cute. Because anyway, I AM white. So I explained to him that I am 白人 and that the "haku" in "hakujin" is the character for "white." He was like "OHHH." I love my nephew.
My problem is when people make a whole bunch of assumptions based on my race, not about seeing my race itself. I don't care if people call me white ('cuz I am). I don't even mind if people stare. Maybe I look different. Maybe I'm just so damn hot. I'm not really that sensitive.
I DON'T mind if I'm having a conversation already with someone and they ask me where I'm from, because if you're talking to me for a while it's obvious I'm not from Japan. I DO have a problem with annoying people I don't know coming up and harassing me about it or speaking in broken English to me in random places, or yelling "gaijin!" and pointing, or complaining about having a "gaijin" near them like, in the hospital, where I'm lying dying on the bed and not making a sound? And this kind of stuff happens too often for comfort.
My main problem is this: white =/= English and white=/=foreign. People need to get this through their heads, or Japan, even Tokyo, will never be "international" as they like to paste everywhere.
You guys seem to like it though, so.....well, I'm just not you.
Note though that I said nothing about people treating me differently because of gender. I was going to mark that people did NOT treat me differently because of gender and was going to put that in the poll... Anyway, I don't care much about that issue...because well, there are already lots and lots of other women in Japan, so it's not like I'm treated differently than anyone else there... I'd love to be treated more different for being a woman rather than for being white though
When over 98% of the population is Japanese I think thats a statement that holds true in an overwhelming majority of cases.
I don't care. It doesn't hold true for my own child.
Anyway, whether it does or doesn't, it's never okay to yell rude things at people or say rude things to them... Jesus Christ, with foreigners like you guys in Japan justifying all the racist crap people do, we'll never make headway.
Well, your situation is your own. I have never known of people using racial epithets towards me, and I am white, too.
I've had some bad experiences based on my being a foreigner, but that pales in comparison to the number of times that it's been a non-issue.
Sweet, White Girl, love the user name. Keep rockin' it.
You're exactly right, many foreigners here in Japan justify most of this sometimes racist and bizarre Japanese behavior. It is sucking up to the nth degree. They always try to give excuses as to why Japanese act a certain way. ...Oh, mabye they didn't hear you, Oh, maybe they don't speak English, Oh, maybe they were just being polite, Oh, maybe it's how you said it, Oh, maybe they don't understand 'gaijin', Oh, maybe they are shy or embarrassed or...whatever. Who cares, it's just tiring.
Some 'gaijin' want to fit in so badly, they turn into conformist robots.
Little do they know that they will never be Japanese nor never 'fit' in.
Of course there are cool, friendly Japanese, which are a joy to talk to.
I have even used some advise from this forumn, which has worked.
Finding these cool Japanese is rare, yet makes living here a pleasure at times.
Could you kindly point out where we've been justifying racist crap?
Thank you.
You do realize that some of the people you're talking to have spent longer than that in Japan just counting the time they've spent sitting on the crapper, don't you?
My undershorts have been here longer than that.
The funny part, my Tennessee homie, is that the ones who complain the loudest and hardest about Japanese noticing they are foreigners (and treating them as foreigners) very often owe their ability to make a living in Japan to using their foreignness as a commodity.
English teachers getting pissed off because Japanese assume they speak English belongs in a Monty Python sketch.
genmai vs. genmai
Couldn't have said it any better myself.
Jeeeez, are you all masochists? Why are you enduring such terrible treatment for so long? You may as well leave such a racist country.
Last edited by diceke; Oct 1, 2007 at 18:34.
guest.I think they didnt call you.You have to adopt the social manners
here and not vice versa.
The Japanese police do stop Japanese on bicycles and check for registration.
I have numerous times seen cops standing in places with little or no foreigner traffic (bicycle or otherwise) and snag one Japanese after another for the checks. When it happens in places with no foreigners around, quite naturally the foreigners don't know it is happening. And with faulty logic they assume that it doesn't happen.
I'm not too familiar with Japanese law on this matter, but then again neither are you. I can say that at least in the USA it is illegal to turn away a customer/refuse to sell them real estate based on their race. I would suppose that similar laws exist in Japan.Really? A privately owned business doesn't have the right to turn anyone they think won't/can't make the payments away? That's the arguement I'm sure they use, or something similar, and it'll probably hold.Not legally they don't.
Can people come up with ways to get away with it in court? Yes. But people get away with a lot of things in court. That doesn't mean it's not illegal.
And I'll bet that no matter what, no judge would accept "because he was a foregner" as an excuse.
this may surprise you,but 90% of all deeds(at least in the south) have a clause saying non-whites cannot buy the house in question. They ignore it, and are trying to get rid of it, but if one wanted to, they could use race as a factor and it'd hold in court. Always read the fine print.
Ahem, so you honestly believe every country that signed the Geneva Convention adheres to it 100% of the time?or at all? I can guarantee that medical personnel and civilians have been fired upon, and that inhumane things are done to POWs by the countries that signed it. Just because a country/person signs something doesn't mean they are going to keep their word.
well, the Patriot Act gives the US government the authority and right to do anything they want to us civilians and violates the Bill of Rights. Ok, let me pose this to you: You are in Russia, you are an officer of the law. You happen to see a very dark skinned man walking down the street. Russia is predominantly white, and you see he cannot speak Russian. Would you not in the least bit go over and at least ask him, if not check his passport, if he was there legally? I don't think anything when a cop asks a Mexican for his greencard, because they have a history of coming illegally.
Well, you just said it's a case by case thing. To me, that just pretty much nullified your arguement on that point. Some people are racist, and some of those find their way into positions of authority. Some are doing it because the person is non-Japanese, others are not. But yes, I agree.
Here's the thing, I didn't move the goalposts. I gave an example of how they are going to phrase it if you call them on it and it goes to court. Does that mean it's fair? No, it doesn't. I have, however, never heard of a private business or landowner getting in trouble for turning someone away since it's not government regulated. That is my point, a privately owned business/landowner can refuse anyone they want.
To be fair though, I don't think the majority of foreigners know what a tatami floor is, let alone how to use one. Myself included. So I wouldn't call that ludicrous, especially if it would cause damage to the floor if not used properly.
Of course not. But countries who sign the Geneva Convention and then break its conditions should be vociferously criticised. Ditto Japan and its non-adherence to the racial discrimination treaty it signed.
Yeah, southerners do a lot of racist things, but they are still breaking US law if they discriminate against someone in a housing transaction, so that nullifies whatever racist scribblings are on the deed. I refer you to the Federal Fair Housing Act of 1968:
http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/housing/title8.htm
http://www.hud.gov/offices/fheo/FHLaws/
"It shall be unlawful to refuse to sell or rent after the making of a bona fide offer, or to refuse to negotiate for the sale or rental of, or otherwise make unavailable or deny, a dwelling to any person because of race, color, religion, sex, familial status, or national origin."
Again, I'm not too clear on Japanese law, but I'm pretty sure there's something like that somewhere.
Good god, man. And what if every police officer in Russia took that attitude and a dark skinned man, who was there for completely legitimate reasons, was stopped three times a day for every day he was in the country? Talk about an unfriendly welcome.Ok, let me pose this to you: You are in Russia, you are an officer of the law. You happen to see a very dark skinned man walking down the street. Russia is predominantly white, and you see he cannot speak Russian. Would you not in the least bit go over and at least ask him, if not check his passport, if he was there legally? I don't think anything when a cop asks a Mexican for his greencard, because they have a history of coming illegally.
Glenski said they can't refuse real estate legally, and you said they can. Even if it holds up in court, that doesn't make it legal, so you are wrong.Here's the thing, I didn't move the goalposts. I gave an example of how they are going to phrase it if you call them on it and it goes to court.
Wrong. See above.That is my point, a privately owned business/landowner can refuse anyone they want.
The real estate market, along with many others, is tightly regulated by strict laws. It's not a free-for-all.
Last edited by JimmySeal; Oct 4, 2007 at 18:16.
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