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Thread: Cute racism a la japonaise ?

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by anjusan
    Ah, was that the gist of kkkktttt's post? I was wondering if anyone would para-phrase that for those of us not quite up to that level... Unfortunately I have seen a few shows that make fun of Japanese people...I have rarely found humor in jokes based upon stereotypes... they tend to make me feel uncomfortable... for those being make fun of...
    ...
    The kkkktttt's gist goes that Maciamo tells much about "Japaneseness" among his hundreds of would-be average J friends share, but what about his own Japaneseness?

  2. #27
    Regular Member anjusan's Avatar
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    Ah, I see, then Maciamo did not yet reply to kkkktttt's post...

    Pipokun, what do you think is meant by their 'Japaneseness'? It was my understanding that Maciamo was French... I am a little confused now...

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    Quote Originally Posted by lastmagi
    Apparently, this view is in the minority, so I'm not sure how "insecurity" has much to do with it if it's something that most agree is a problem. Nor do I see how this argument necessarily leads up to claims of open-mindedness.

    My point was aimed specifically at the things Maciamo posted, like Japanese asking him if he asks sushi, if Belgium has four seasons and things like that.

    I do not deny that racism does exist, but I don't think these are valid examples of it.

    Remember this is exactly what Maciamo posted

    So racism is maybe a way for some Japanese to become more confident, by doing all they can to make "gaijins" look stupid or inferior, going as far as inventing theories such as Japanese having unique brains, being able to eat food that foreigners can't eat, or claiming that Japan is unique for its four seasons and cherry blossoms, or other narrow-minded (and deeply mistaken) nationalistic propaganda

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaijin 06
    My point was aimed specifically at the things Maciamo posted, like Japanese asking him if he asks sushi, if Belgium has four seasons and things like that.

    I do not deny that racism does exist, but I don't think these are valid examples of it.
    Are you actually denying that the cherry blossom is the national(istic) symbol of Japan ? What's more, "sakura" (cherry blossom) is a common name both for people (used in given and family name) and company names. I find that latter particularily strange (Sakura Bank, Sakura Rubber, Sakura Industries ?). Entering the keywords sakura kabushiki kaisha (cherry blossom limited company), I got 2 million results ! Most Japanese regard the cherry tree as a symbol of their culture and identity, so it is not so far fetched that they should think of it as uniquely Japanese. Naturally (no pun intended), blossoms are associated with the 4 seasons, leading them to believe that if cherry (or plum) blossoms are "Japanese", then Spring as known in Japan is somehow unique to Japan, and therefore other countries may not have the same seasonal process. It sounds absurd to a Westerner, but believe me, it is not to the average Japanese.

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  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by pipokun
    The kkkktttt's gist goes that Maciamo tells much about "Japaneseness" among his hundreds of would-be average J friends share, but what about his own Japaneseness?
    This is not what kkkktttt wrote. The first paragraph is about the nihonjinron (not "Japaneseness" but "racist theory of Japaneseness"). I don't see how my explanations about what I experience in Japan is similar to the "nihonjinron". These are just facts such as how gaijins are made fun of, or subtitled in katakana on TV, or the Japanese obsession with questions about foreigners' opinion of Japan, and whether foreigners can eat this or that, or if they had ever experienced the 4 seasons before coming to their beautiful country... But maybe for kkkktttt, the nihonjinron (claiming Japanese racial superioty) is also based on facts ?

    The second paragraph is the one I replied to. I am still waiting for an answer.

    And for the record, it is not because I speak French that I am French.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    kkkktttt, in which country did you see TV variety shows making fun of Japanese people ? I have never seen such programmes (or movies) on French, Belgian or British TV. Of course, if you take the US or China as reference, you are up for surprises...
    イギリスの例を一つ
    http://tviv.org/wiki/Banzai

    また、ハンガリーでは次のような番組が放映されていたそうです。
    http://www.sankei.co.jp/edit/bunka/2...ji/0501tv.html
    この番組はもともとオランダで製作され、欧州の複数の 国で放映されてたものを、ハンガリーの放送局が版 購入し独自に製作したものだそうです。

    日本人の大半はこれらの番組を笑って済ますぐらいの余裕が ると思いますが、海外に住みマイノリティーとして差別問題に敏感にならざるを得ない日本人の中に はracismを感じる人も少なくないでしょう。ちょうど現 在の なたのように。

    そういえばフランス映画「タクシー2」でもおかしな日本人が描かれていましたね。

    ベルギーについてはそもそもどのような番組が放映されているか 知らないので何ともいえません。

    詳しくはgoogleで「変な日本」 るいは「ヘンな日本」 で調べてみてください。
    http://www.google.com/search?num=50&...5%E6%9C%AC&lr=
    http://www.google.com/search?num=50&...C%E7%B4%A2&lr=

    そもそも欧州では、各国の人々をステレオタイプ化して ネタにするアネクドートがまさに「文化」として根付いているのではないです か?
    その中には日本人をネタにしたものも るはずです。

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by anjusan
    ...I have rarely found humor in jokes based upon stereotypes... they tend to make me feel uncomfortable... for those being make fun of...
    Well, I'm a German & have seen a number of British comedy shows making fun of German stereotypes. I can't see much of a problem there. The problem is more in education. When you learn the same stereotypes at school or only learn about the stuff these stereotypes are built upon you may actually believe in the content of these TV shows.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    Are you actually denying that the cherry blossom is the national(istic) symbol of Japan ? What's more, "sakura" (cherry blossom) is a common name both for people (used in given and family name) and company names. I find that latter particularily strange (Sakura Bank, Sakura Rubber, Sakura Industries ?). Entering the keywords sakura kabushiki kaisha (cherry blossom limited company), I got 2 million results ! Most Japanese regard the cherry tree as a symbol of their culture and identity, so it is not so far fetched that they should think of it as uniquely Japanese. Naturally (no pun intended), blossoms are associated with the 4 seasons, leading them to believe that if cherry (or plum) blossoms are "Japanese", then Spring as known in Japan is somehow unique to Japan, and therefore other countries may not have the same seasonal process. It sounds absurd to a Westerner, but believe me, it is not to the average Japanese.
    Would you consider a Canadian racist if he asked you if you like maple syrup?

  9. #34
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    日本人論=racist theory of Japanesenessではないですよ。
    日本人論の中には優越主義的なものも りますが、自ら を否定的に描くものも少なく りません。
    また、「荒唐無稽」といった通り、いわゆる日本人論の 多くはせいぜい酒席のネタ程度のものでそれほど真剣に 捉えられている訳では りません。

    「日本人論」で れ「欧州人論」なんで れ、一見それ を根拠づけるような「それなりの事実」は るんですね 。
    問題はそれを絶対化して特定の集団の特徴として論ずる 点ではないですか?

    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    Of course, if you take the US or China as reference, you are up for surprises...
    そもそも、唯一の超大国と世界最大の人口を持つ国を「 例外」とすること自体にムリが りますね。

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaijin 06
    Would you consider a Canadian racist if he asked you if you like maple syrup?
    Not more than a Japanese who asked me if I liked sushi. The problem with you is that you don't pay attention to wording and context, so you always think I mean things I don't mean.

    There is a big difference between saying "Can foreigners eat sushi" "Do you like sushi". I have found Japanese people to ask me whether (all/most) foreigners or people from my country could eat this or that. Some would even say quite factually that "foreigners can't eat sushi, natto or whatever". I don't mind them asking me if I like it (not if I can eat it), but I question their vision of the world and conception of "foreigners" when they talk of "foreigners" as if it was a homogenous group, and even more when they doubt their ability to appreciate Japanese things (especially regarding foreigner living in Japan by choice).

    My typical reaction when they ask me whether "foreigners have this or can do that" is to ask them which country they are referring to. Usually say that I can't speak on behalf of the Chinese or Nigerians, but if they want to know about my close relatives maybe I can try to answer their question.

    Secondly, I didn't say that such behaviour in itself was racist, but underlied a way of thinking influenced by nationalistic or racist elements. You also confuse my points about nationalism and racism. Cherry blossoms are an obvious nationalist symbol, for instance, but has nothing racist. In this thread, I pointed out that both nationalism and racism as reaction to the latent Japanese sense of insecurity, and sense of inferiority towar the West. The TV stuff I started this thread with was an example of (soft) racism; the cherry blossoms and seasons, an example of common subconscious influenced by nationalistic symbols. It makes the Japanese feel "better" if they can proudly claim that "cherry blossoms are Japanese". Got it ?

  11. #36
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    「寿司は食べられますか?」
    寿司は現在世界的なブームですが、わずか十年ほど前までは「生で魚を食べるな んて不衛生でグロテスクの極み」だと揶揄さたものでし た。
    お隣の中国でさえ魚を生で食べることは一般には りま せんでした。
    日本人が「寿司は食べられるか?」と尋ねるのはそのよ うな実態が ったからです。その点では日本人の認識に 「時差」が るのかもしれません。

    日本人の多くは自国の文化に誇りを持ってはいますが、 同時に余り普遍性がないとも思っています。なにしろ長らく外国 に積極的に発信することもなく、とことん「日本人向け 」に築き上げられてきた文化ですから。
    普遍性=偉大性と捉えるならば、その点では傲慢さとは 対極に ると思いますね。


    「四季」について
    もちろん季節に移り変わりが るのは日本だけでは り ません。当たり前のことです。
    ただ、温暖湿潤気候帯に属すること、季節風の影響を受 けやすい大陸の東側に位置すること、国土が南北に長く 亜熱帯から亜寒帯まで幅広い気候に恵まれること、など から、国土面積の割にはその変化・多様性が比較的豊か な国の一つで るとはいえると思います。
    ちなみにベルギー観光局の宣伝文句は「四季が流れる国、ベルギー」だそうです。
    http://www.belgium-travel.jp/

    Maciamoさんの投稿を見て思うのですが、 なたは自信 失っているのでは りませんか。
    もう少し自分に自身と余裕が るのならば、桜について日本人が誇らしげに語る ことぐらい特段に気にもしないはずです。わたしも桜は 大好きですが、しかし、しょせん花のことなんですから 。

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    Not more than a Japanese who asked me if I liked sushi. The problem with you is that you don't pay attention to wording and context, so you always think I mean things I don't mean.
    I fail to see how this statement can be taken out of context

    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    So racism is maybe a way for some Japanese to become more confident, by doing all they can to make "gaijins" look stupid or inferior, going as far as inventing theories such as Japanese having unique brains, being able to eat food that foreigners can't eat, or claiming that Japan is unique for its four seasons and cherry blossoms

  13. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gaijin 06
    I fail to see how this statement can be taken out of context
    I don't see any inconsistencies with what I explained above. Maybe you should try harder to read what I wrote, and not what you want to understand.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkkktttt
    日本人論=racist theory of Japanesenessではないですよ。
    日本人論の中には優越主義的なものもありますが、自らを否定的に描くものも少なくありません。
    また、「荒唐無稽」といった通り、いわゆる日本人論の多くはせいぜい酒席のネタ程度のものでそれほど真剣に 捉えられている訳ではありません。
    If the "nihonjinron" is mostly limited to jokes at drinking parties, how do you explain that so many books were written about it, and that Tokyo Governor Shintaro Ishihara has political views well in line with the "nihonjinron" ?

    There have been similar racist theories of "White supremacy" (e.g. Nazism), but rare are the people who still agree with them or would publicly express them. I think that you (as a Japanese) do not understand that in Western countries, because such theories existed, there has been a movement to ban them, especially after the disastrous consequences of Nazism in WWII. However, I feel very much that the Japanese have no such taboo about it, and don't even realise that it is taboo for Westerners. Visibly, you also think it's ok at a drinking party...

    そもそも、唯一の超大国と世界最大の人口を持つ国を「例外」とすること自体にムリがありますね 。
    Well, I am not American nor Chinese, but European. I compare Japan to what I know best, and this is Europe, or more specifically the Benelux, France or Britain, which are the countries I know best in Europe. I have also criticised a lot the US - probably more than Japan. So, what's the point telling me that the US may be worse than Japan in this regard ? It still doesn't make Japan on the particular issue of racism alright by my standards.

    Just to give you an idea of the treatment of foreigners in Belgium :

    - All foreigners have the right to vote at local election. (not in Japan)
    - Belgium provides integration courses for immigrants, including very cheap (sometimes free) language classes.
    - Foreigners don't have to carry an alien registration card (but Belgium must carry an ID card)
    - Foreigners can benefit from social security. (something I disagree with, but that is how it is).
    - Foreigners married to a Belgian don't need a (spouse) visa, and can obtain Belgian citizenship after 6 months of marriage (as opposed to 4-5 years in Japan).
    - In 2001, Belgium had 24,000 asylum seekers, as opposed to 400 in Japan. Belgium having a population and land area 13x smaller than Japan, it means that Belgium accepted 780x more asylum seekers per inhabitant than Japan. (sources)
    Furthermore, the acceptance rate of asylum seekers in Belgium is 24.5%, against 9.2% in Japan (sources)

    This is off-topic, but it may help you understand what is "normal" for me as a Belgian (and not for American or Chinese people). So I may be a bit more sensitive to issues of foreigners' rights, discrimination of racism than international average. But I am entitled to an opinion too, ain't I ?
    Last edited by Maciamo; Nov 25, 2005 at 17:07.

  15. #40
    Twirling dragon Maciamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkkktttt
    「寿司は食べられますか?」
    寿司は現在世界的なブームですが、わずか十年ほど前までは「生で魚を食べるなんて不衛生でグロテスクの極み 」だと揶揄さたものでした。
    Were there protests (outside Japan ?) against eating raw fish 10 years ago ? Where ? Sorry, I have never heard about this in Belgium. Did China participate ? If not that's strange because some Japanese businessmen I teach were so surprised when I told them that I saw sushi restaurant in Shanghai and Beijing. Their reaction (2 different people) was the same : "But Chinese people don't eat raw fish !". Well, apparently they do.

    お隣の中国でさえ魚を生で食べることは一般にはありませんでした。
    Here we go ! So you also think that the Chinese don't eat raw fish ! In fact, I asked our Chinese guide in Beijing this month, and "raw fish"; although less common than in Japan, is also part of traditional Chinese cuisine. They don't call it 寿司 (sushi) or 刺身 (sashimi) but 生魚片 (shengyupian) or something like that (my Chinese is very basic).

    Then in several European countries, people have been eating raw fis for centuries. One of the most stereotypical food of the Netherlands is the "maatjes" (raw herring). Scandinavians also eat raw fish, and to a lesser extent Mediteranean people too. I guess that among Westerners, it is mostly in English-speaking countries, France* or Central-Eastern Europe that it is not part of traditional food. In places far from the sea, it is fairly normal. As for Britain, well, people boil or bake everything there !

    Yet, most Western countries (including France and English-speaking countries) do have a tradition of eating raw oysters (alive).

    日本人の多くは自国の文化に誇りを持ってはいますが、同時に余り普遍性がないとも思っています。なにしろ長 らく外国に積極的に発信することもなく、とことん「日本人向け」に築き上げられてきた文化です から。
    The problem is not that raw fish is not eaten universally. What I dislike is people who assume that I can't eat raw fish because I am a foreigner. Even if raw fish is not commonly eaten in one country, it doesn't mean that people cannot appreciate it. Other Japanese dishes like "soba" or "okonomiyaki" are more typically Japanese than raw fish. Indeed I don't know any other country that have the same dish in their tradition, and such restaurant are much rarer than sushi in Western countries. Yet, not a single Japanese person has asked me whether I "could" eat soba or okonomiyaki. Why ? I don't know. It's probably because so many Japanese have the strange idea that sushi/sashimi is a kind of food that only Japanese people can appreciate. This is what I call a "misconception regarding foreigners/Westerners". In fact, I found that more Western friends of mine don't like much soba (especially cold), but almost all of them love sushi.

    I suppose that if that idea that Westerners dislike raw fish is so widespread in Japan (although I never heard it before coming to Japan), it is because the media have advertised this idea. Why would they do that ?

    1) Either by ignorance - looking only at the US to define all Western countries, which is a huge mistake, as the US is a melting pot of world cultures, which developed a society very different from European cultures.

    2) In an attempt to create a idea that the Japanese could so things that "foreigners" couldn't. Why ? It's not clear, but as I said above, probably out of a sense of insecurity or complex of inferiority/superiority.

    「四季」について
    もちろん季節に移り変わりがあるのは日本だけではありません。当たり前のことです。
    It doesn't seem so obvious to all Japanese that not only Japan has four seasons. Or at least, it is not obvious to them that all Europe does. Otherwise, why would it be such a common question, and why would some people be surprised when I say that Belgium, or France, or Italy all have 4 seasons ? Even my wife admitted that she did not know that before going to Europe (before meeting me). That's very strange for me. What do Japanese people learn at school about geography, I asked my wife. She said that 1) not everybody takes geography classes (it's not compulsory like in Europe), and 2) some teachers had told her that Japan was one of the rare countries in the world to have 4 seasons (I can't speak for other Japanese, but in her case, and other friends to whom I asked, that is what they were told).

    Strangly, nobody asked me whether my country had a continental, oceanic, temperate cold, temperate warm, subtropical or other kind of climate. Well, of course, if Japanese people don't learn that at school, how would they all know about it ?

    ちなみにベルギー観光局の宣伝文句は「四季が流れる国、ベルギー」だそうです。
    http://www.belgium-travel.jp/
    That's right - Belgium also has 4 seasons. So what ? The question is : why does the Japanese website of the Belgian Tourist Office mention it, while the American website or French website don't ? Answer : 1) it's obvious to Westerners that Belgium has 4 seasons (but not to all Japanese), and 2) the Japanese spend a lot of money in "season tourism", which includes far away trips to see blossoms or autumn leaves.

    もう少し自分に自身と余裕があるのならば、桜について日本人が誇らしげに語ることぐらい特段に気にもしない はずです。わたしも桜は大好きですが、しかし、しょせん花のことなんですから。
    I was sure that you completely misunderstood me since the beginning, as I couldn't see where your replies were leading to. So you think that I dislike cherry blossoms, and should be more tolerant toward the Japanese like you who like them very much ? You are a good example of what I am complaining about among Japanese people. First of all, I also like watching blossoms, flowers, autumn leaves, etc. In fact, I like it so much that I have taken many pictures of them in Japan (just check the Gallery), and even wrote a special page about parks and gardens in Tokyo, with the list of major trees and flowers in each, and recommendations about which is better for plum or cherry blossoms or autumn leaves (check the detail pages, clicking on the garden names). What irritates me is that most Japanese believe that admiring the seasons is something foreigners don't know and cannot fully appreciate. Many Japanese I met assumed that there were no trees in blossoms or no autumn leaves where I come from. This makes me angry, because :

    1) it shows how ignorant they are of the world. Ignorance of such basic things is as much a crime to me as the "lack of appreciation for good food" would be for most Japanese.

    2) it is condescending to think that someone cannot appreciate something because it is not part of their culture (e.g. cherry blossom viewing). This is the kind of attitude I call "dangerously close to racism" : If someone is not Japanese, they can't appreciate Japanese culture, e.g. cherry blossoms or sushi. Believe me, I have met people who told me that.

    But I admit being more "sensitive" to people doubting my ability to do something than most people. It is more an insult to me to say (or even just imply) that I could not possibly do or appreciate something as well as someone else, than calling me names. Other Westerners who do not understand why I complain so much are just more thick-skinned.

  16. #41
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    I skipped most of this cause i got the general idea of this thread..

    What about that show called takeshi's castle?
    I find that pretty funny...I know its pretty old But still my point stands.

    And my point is that they too do stupid things along with everyone else.
    Maybe i will take more notice when these things happen to me...as with most human beings.


  17. #42
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    Maciamoさん、欧州にも「外国人を笑いのネタにするバ 宴Cティ番組」が存在することはご理解頂けましたか?
    確かに欧米では「アフリカ系の人々」を からさまに笑 い飛ばすようなバライティ番組はタブーなのかもしれません。もちろん、その背景には過酷なア フリカ人差別の歴史が るわけです。
    同様の例は日本でも ります。 なたは韓国人をネタに したお笑い番組を見たことは りますか?日本では韓国 人をそのように描くことはタブーとなっています。
    それぞれの社会には、各の歴史を背景とするタブーが存在するわけです。欧米の基準を絶対化して日本を判 断するのは誤りですね。

    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    Were there protests (outside Japan ?) against eating raw fish 10 years ago ? Where ? Sorry, I have never heard about this in Belgium. Did China participate ? If not that's strange because some Japanese businessmen I teach were so surprised when I told them that I saw sushi restaurant in Shanghai and Beijing. Their reaction (2 different people) was the same : "But Chinese people don't eat raw fish !". Well, apparently they do.



    Here we go ! So you also think that the Chinese don't eat raw fish ! In fact, I asked our Chinese guide in Beijing this month, and "raw fish"; although less common than in Japan, is also part of traditional Chinese cuisine. They don't call it 寿司 (sushi) or 刺身 (sashimi) but 生魚片 (shengyupian) or something like that (my Chinese is very basic).
    中国人は古代には生魚を食べていたようですが、明や清 の時代以降は、一部の「美食」を除いて、一般には食べ られなくなったそうです。生魚が再び広く食べられるよ うになったのは改革開放の進んだ最近の話です。
    しかし、上海などの沿岸地域や大都市の出身者はともか く地方出身者にはいまだに「生魚を料理として認めない 」ような人は多いですよ。
    http://www.sinorama.com.tw/jp/1999/199903/803024j1.html
    http://www2u.biglobe.ne.jp/~yangzi/m.../beijing04.htm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    It doesn't seem so obvious to all Japanese that not only Japan has four seasons. Or at least, it is not obvious to them that all Europe does. Otherwise, why would it be such a common question, and why would some people be surprised when I say that Belgium, or France, or Italy all have 4 seasons ? Even my wife admitted that she did not know that before going to Europe (before meeting me). That's very strange for me. What do Japanese people learn at school about geography, I asked my wife. She said that 1) not everybody takes geography classes (it's not compulsory like in Europe), and 2) some teachers had told her that Japan was one of the rare countries in the world to have 4 seasons (I can't speak for other Japanese, but in her case, and other friends to whom I asked, that is what they were told).
    世界の気候については小学校、中学校、高校とそれぞれ のレベルに応じて習いますよ。高校では選択制ですが、 小・中学校では義務教育として習うはずです。奥さんは 忘れているだけではないですか?
    地理の時間だけでは りません。
    Antonio Vivaldiの「The Four Seasons」は日本でもっとも好まれるクラッシック曲の 黷ツで、学校の音楽の授業でも習います。欧州には の 謔、な名曲を生み出す美しい「四季」が るわけですね B
    会話の内容にもよりますが、もし本当に「春夏秋冬は日 本にだけ る」などと思い込んでいたのならば、もう一 度義務教育をやり直すよう勧めてください。

  19. #44
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    ベルギーでMaciamoさんと同じような境遇に った日本人の例を ミ介します。
    母国を相対的に見ることによって、 るいは著者の「解 決法」を学ぶことによって、日本社会との「つき い方 」がこなれてくるかもしれないですよ。
    http://www.infoplaza.be/belgium/bovy21/bo216225.htm

  20. #45
    Twirling dragon Maciamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkkktttt
    中国人は古代には生魚を食べていたようですが、明や清 の時代以降は、一部の「美食」を除いて、一般には食べ られなくなったそうです。生魚が再び広く食べられるよ うになったのは改革開放の進んだ最近の話です。
    しかし、上海などの沿岸地域や大都市の出身者はともか く地方出身者にはいまだに「生魚を料理として認めない 」ような人は多いですよ。
    http://www.sinorama.com.tw/jp/1999/199903/803024j1.html
    http://www2u.biglobe.ne.jp/~yangzi/m.../beijing04.htm
    Whatever these Japanese say, do you doubt the word of my Chinese guide, born and raised in China, who said that there is also raw fish in Chinese food, not just in Japanese restaurant in China ? She was not speaking about ancient times.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    Whatever these Japanese say, do you doubt the word of my Chinese guide, born and raised in China, who said that there is also raw fish in Chinese food, not just in Japanese restaurant in China ? She was not speaking about ancient times.
    中国人も言っていますよ。
    http://www.joho-kyoto.or.jp/~lions/benron03/t03-03.html

    googleで「中国人」「刺身」で検索してみてください。実体験に基づいたエピソードが数多く見つかりま す。すくなくとも、この点において日本人が全く根拠のないことをいっているわけではないことはご理解頂ける と思います。
    http://www.google.com/search?num=50&...88%BA%E8%BA%AB

    まあ、中国は広いですから例外的な地域はあるかもしれませんが。
    また、最近といっても中国が改革開放政策に転じて20年以上経過しているわけですから、ガイドさんの年齢に よっては「生まれた頃から食べている」ということになるのかもしれません。

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maciamo
    Well, I am not American nor Chinese, but European. I compare Japan to what I know best, and this is Europe, or more specifically the Benelux, France or Britain, which are the countries I know best in Europe. I have also criticised a lot the US - probably more than Japan. So, what's the point telling me that the US may be worse than Japan in this regard ? It still doesn't make Japan on the particular issue of racism alright by my standards.
    あなたが、バライティ番組で外国人を笑いのネタにすることを「a typically Japanese phenomenon」と言ったことに対しての発言です。日本人に典型である(=「日本人論」)というのな らば、少なくともこの二大国について調査しないのは適当ではないと思ったわけです。「他にはない」ことを証 明しなければ「典型的」とは言えないでしょ?
    ご理解頂けましたか?

  23. #48
    Twirling dragon Maciamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkkktttt
    世界の気候については小学校、中学校、高校とそれぞれ のレベルに応じて習いますよ。高校では選択制ですが、 小・中学校では義務教育として習うはずです。奥さんは 忘れているだけではないですか?
    She could have forgotten, but then so did her 4 friends we asked, and so did about 50 of my students.

    Antonio Vivaldiの「The Four Seasons」は日本でもっとも好まれるクラッシック曲の 黷ツで、学校の音楽の授業でも習います。欧州には の 謔、な名曲を生み出す美しい「四季」が るわけですね B
    Exactly ! That's what I have answered a few times when I was asked whether Europe also had 4 seasons. Tonight again, we were talking about Italy, and I was asked if Italy had 4 seasons... Well, Vivaldi was Italian, they should know...

    会話の内容にもよりますが、もし本当に「春夏秋冬は日 本にだけ る」などと思い込んでいたのならば、もう一 度義務教育をやり直すよう勧めてください。
    I completely agree. But then many business men and women I have met should go back to school. It should be quite obvious that Europe has four seasons, since the names for each season (spring, summer, autumn, winter) exist in every European language. If they weren't 4 seasons, why should they be just 4 names for them ?

  24. #49
    Twirling dragon Maciamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kkkktttt
    なたが、バライティ番組で外国人を笑いのネタにする ことを「a typically Japanese phenomenon」と言ったことに対しての発言です。日本人 に典型で る(=「日本人論」)というのならば、少な くともこの二大国について調査しないのは適当ではない と思ったわけです。「他にはない」ことを証明しなけれ ば「典型的」とは言えないでしょ?
    ご理解頂けましたか?
    I said that cute racism was a typically Japanese phenomenon. It's not the same as making ethnic jokes between Japanese. I am talking of recruiting foreigners and making them do stupid things, or making them look stupid by giving them katakana subtitles. In fact, some of the foreigners on TV do not even have to act stupidly to make the Japanese people on TV laugh (and the audience I guess). As other people said, many Japanese just find it hilarious to see a foreigner do things that are completely normal for Japanese people. As far as I know, there is no such TV programmes anywhere else. If there is, please tell me the name of the programme, channel and country where it is shown.

  25. #50
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    Fine disreguard what I said.....

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