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Thread: UNSC bid of Japan, Germany, India and Brazil rejected. Is Japan to blame ?

  1. #26
    Regular Member CBT1979's Avatar
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    Honestly, the best thing to provide a better working UN security council, no nation should be able to use Veto!
    The Veto right of the 5 permanent UN member is a big obstacle to reach resolutions since we had many Vetos from the USA and Russia which have hindered many resolutions to act.
    Look at the Lebanon-Israel conflict for example when the USA used their Veto to block a step to stop Israel's onslaught.

    The Veto option is a big slap in the face of democracy IMO.

  2. #27
    Deus Ex Machina Dr. J. M.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sukotto View Post
    UK, France, Russia. That looks like 3 to me. Since the majority of Russian political power/population is west of the Ural mountains (in Europe).
    Alright, letfs narrow it down to gWestern Europeh, I didnft consider Russia as gEuropeh because it is not part of the EU.
    Well, how many stolen elections have Russian and China had in the last 7 years?
    Is this supposed to be a joke? You cannot consider any election held in the Peoplefs Republic of China as genuine, thus all can be considered as stolen. In Russia itfs either 1 stolen election or 0. This depends on who you ask about Putins policy.
    Have any of those two lied to their populations to start a war of aggression.
    If you consider the war in Chechnya (by Russia) or the war against your very own people (by China) a war of aggression...
    Or are involved in just about every other ongoing war of conflict in some way or another?
    Yes, in some way or another they are involved via the UN Security Council
    This last sentance few people in the US are aware about.
    Obviously.
    Do China & Russia maintain a militarist society even though they have no REAL enemies?
    Yes, even more so than the US, imho.
    while maintaining tHE largest prison population on the planet, tossing addicts in cages,
    No, but they have the highest number of people executed. Which is worse at least in my opinion.
    health care falling apart (when will the first American epidemic sweep the country? they've already LET an entire city drown)
    What health care?! Their hospitals are a joke in comparison! And itfs more the rule than the exception that Chinese cities drown.
    letting cities rot from the inside with the only solution from gov't to militarize the police forces (with automatic weapons and body armor they look like they belong in a combat zone).
    Youfve never been in either country, have you?
    they don't care if kids in the inner city drop out of school in the 4TH~! grade (this is the current generations, not 60 years ago)
    Depending on where you go (especially in China) children do not attend school at all.
    But, hey, at least those people that drop out in the 4th grade tend to realize the US gov't is a total crock and not there to help the populous (unless maybe you're upper middle class and probably white) - notice I didn't state "Bush".
    Since you obviously hold the same opinions as these drop-outs, does it mean that youfve dropped out of the 4th grade yourself? (Sorry, I had to say that, please donft take it seriously... I was just kidding.)
    Unless you maintain that a country is not a "failed state" as long as there is a government that can remain in power and maintain a lid on the problems by any means necessary...if the maintenance of gov't is all that makes it NOT a failed state, then sure the US is not a failed state. Everything's A-ok. Just get those Hi-definition tvs out there quick. The spectacle is starting to fail.
    You should travel around more often. Try Cuba thatfs not that far off. If you are particularly brave go to Africa (not the tourist regions... try the Democratic Republic of the Congo). Or visit Russia and China yourselfc
    Mors stupebit et natura, cum resurget creatura, judicanti responsura.

  3. #28
    Regular Member Sukotto's Avatar
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    Maybe I shouldn't have used the term "state", since it is a tool of repression afterall, and any failed state, is a good state. Unless it results in deaths of course. hahahar.

    Er, no joke. The last two presidential elections in the US are more easily verifiably stolen than those in China or Russia, which many do not expect to be "free & fair". (especially the former one) But people have a right to self-determination anyway.

    Ongoing wars? Overt, covert. the crimes against humanity machine called the CIA. Both types of war. I tend to doubt the UN is involved in helping Israel plan its attack on Lebannon or
    Indirectly Funding Al-Qaeda Linked Sunni Groups in Move to Counter Iran according to the highly reputable Seymour Hersh.

    Cuba? I heard if you complain about waiting in line for ice cream for an hour and you are a foreigner they will give you yours right away. Why would I want to visit GIJoe?

    The US doesn't pretend to want to be like the countries in Africa or Latin America. The comparison is usually to the "rich-industialized" countries that supposedly can afford stuff like health care and to not be subtly preparing for martial law. And besides the US was supposed to be the wealthies country in the world and also prisons are obsolete, or at least Angela Davis asks if they are. In fact many in the US believe their country to be above or better than any other country in the world. Which is a total joke for no other reason than it is arrogant and a mere opinion. People tend like their homes best. And claim it to be a leader. (leave aside for now the fact that any such claim is a self-appointed one) But the US leads the world in incarceration. Which I cannot compare to the death penalty because they are both symptoms of a police state. And then there's the stuff Bush has been doing.....

    Afterall,
    "All I really need to know I learned in kindergarten" hehe
    check out this awesome shirt.
    If You're Really a Goth, Where Were You When We Sacked Rome?
    no, i got nothing against goths. just think the shirt is neat.

  4. #29
    Regular Member Sukotto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. J. M. View Post
    Since you obviously hold the same opinions as these drop-outs, does it mean that youfve dropped out of the 4th grade yourself? (Sorry, I had to say that, please donft take it seriously... I was just kidding.)
    Haha. Awesome. No, they just didn't get full indoctrination.
    Sirius2B
    says the following which I take for my own ends here:
    here is an example of what I said about the recent hypocrecy of the term "Westernization".... look for example the books of Samuel Huntington (he theaches racism in Harvard)... saying that Latin America has a "Latin culture", and therefore it is not "Western"
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. J. M. View Post
    You should travel around more often. Try Cuba thatfs not that far off. If you are particularly brave go to Africa (not the tourist regions... try the Democratic Republic of the Congo). Or visit Russia and China yourselfc
    I might get killed. The legacy of King Leopold II didn't end with his death. Other exploiters learned from his example and continued to adapted/evolve. But they always say the same basic thing: the way things are is natural. Of course.

  5. #30
    Deus Ex Machina Dr. J. M.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sukotto View Post
    Haha. Awesome. No, they just didn't get full indoctrination.
    Ah, I see, so education means indoctrination, huh? Don't get me wrong, criticism is vital to every society, but your criticism of the US as a 'failed state' is way off the mark (considering that you did not criticize China or Russia makes your assertion ignorant at best and hypocritical at worst.). Unless you think that the vast majority of states all around the world are failures, that is.
    I might get killed. The legacy of King Leopold II didn't end with his death. Other exploiters learned from his example and continued to adapted/evolve. But they always say the same basic thing: the way things are is natural. Of course.
    Natural? Probably. How things are in nature is not how they ought to be. The particular example is the logical outcome of a deeply flawed colonial policy. But how does this affect the US as a failed state? (Probalby a subtle criticism of the US foreign policy I guess.)
    How do you define a 'failed state' anyway?

  6. #31
    Regular Member Sukotto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. J. M. View Post
    You should travel around more often. Try Cuba thatfs not that far off. If you are particularly brave go to Africa (not the tourist regions... try the Democratic Republic of the Congo). Or visit Russia and China yourselfc

    I might get offed by some thugs the US once armed and paid to kill, murder, and rape their own people, in the name of anti-communism, but really in defense of corporate (legal entities) interests, that continue to rape other people's countries, see Shell Oil or Cheveron in Nigeria for 2 examples.
    Or those that got guns from rev Pat Robertson in Congo (then Zaire)
    Or that got raped by "nice" colonial take-over mechanisms such as the IMF and World Bank and a bribed local official.

    The scariest people live in washington

  7. #32
    Regular Member Sukotto's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. J. M. View Post
    Ah, I see, so education means indoctrination, huh? Don't get me wrong, criticism is vital to every society, but your criticism of the US as a 'failed state' is way off the mark (considering that you did not criticize China or Russia makes your assertion ignorant at best and hypocritical at worst.). Unless you think that the vast majority of states all around the world are failures, that is.
    Natural? Probably. How things are in nature is not how they ought to be. The particular example is the logical outcome of a deeply flawed colonial policy. But how does this affect the US as a failed state? (Probalby a subtle criticism of the US foreign policy I guess.)
    How do you define a 'failed state' anyway?

    Uh, yes. "a deeply flawed colonial policy". Not that.. there.. is... a good colonial policy..., right?
    I mean, maybe I'm reading your words wrong, but you're not suggesting that, are you?
    The IMF, World Bank are logical extensions of Leopold's system of exploitation. He wanted to "open" up the Congo to "free trade" for all (colonial powers) to exploit in peace(among each other). Even tried to mark himself as a savior of the area. What a joke. Just as the exploiters of the World Bank and IMF are. People are constantly jump ship or leak documents about the bad stuff they do from behind the P.R. front. Economist Joseph Stiglitz won some prizes and denounced those institutions as bunk.

    I agree,
    Russia and China probably dissappear people too,
    just as the US does. And torture, in the name of
    state security, of course...

  8. #33
    Deus Ex Machina Dr. J. M.'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sukotto View Post
    Uh, yes. "a deeply flawed colonial policy". Not that.. there.. is... a good colonial policy..., right?
    I mean, maybe I'm reading your words wrong, but you're not suggesting that, are you?
    Well, actually no, no I'm not suggesting that. I merely wanted to specifiy what kind of policy was deeply flawed in that case. I thought "foreign policy" was a too broad term for that.
    The IMF, World Bank are logical extensions of Leopold's system of exploitation. He wanted to "open" up the Congo to "free trade" for all (colonial powers) to exploit in peace(among each other). Even tried to mark himself as a savior of the area. What a joke. Just as the exploiters of the World Bank and IMF are. People are constantly jump ship or leak documents about the bad stuff they do from behind the P.R. front. Economist Joseph Stiglitz won some prizes and denounced those institutions as bunk.
    I'm not too fond of the IMF and the World Bank myself, because, as you correctly point out, they hurt more than they help (and those who are 'helped' by these institutions don't need help...)
    I agree,
    Russia and China probably dissappear people too,
    just as the US does. And torture, in the name of
    state security, of course...
    It's not the question whether or not a state (or for that matter any human being) has flaws or behaves in an immoral way, the question is: to what extend?

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